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It occurred to me last night while watching Tim perform songs like DIRTY CREATURE, SHARK ATTACK and SIX MONTHS IN A LEAKY BOAT that the man practically IS or WAS Split Enz. Members such as Phil Judd and Eddie Raynor also made essential additions to the music and songwriting. And Neil Finn assumed more and more prominence as the years progressed.

But seeing Neil is busy with Crowded House, I am just thinking - could Tim continue on under the moniker of SPLIT ENZ - similar to how Neil is continuing the Crowdies?

What do you think?

2009 marks 25 years since the last Enz studio album.
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Funny......I was just going on a journey of sorts through youtube clips (funny how it turns into a journey) and on one of the stops was an interview with Neil where he said Tim prefers to be solo as opposed to being in a band. If that's (still) the case, I wouldn't hold my breath.

And I concur......Split Enz was more than just Tim Finn. Split Enz was very collaborative.
I don't agree that Tim is or was Split Enz because if Neil had not joined & given the new creative spark that the Enz needed at the time, they certainly would have folded around the time of the "Frenzy" era. It was this era in 1978 when the band were in the worst period of their existence when they recorded the Luton sessions which in turn triggered off their best work up until that date & also what was to come after Frenzy (True Colours, Corroboree, Time & Tide).

My point is, If Phil had stayed, then the band would have imploded & moved on & we would not be witnessing today what we now call Crowded House so there is a good possibility that True Colours, Corroboree, Time & Tide etc. would never have been recorded & Split Enz would not have the legacy they have now.

As for another studio album (Split Enz), it would be interesting to see what they could come up with 25 years later but I believe that both Tim & Neil's songs these days are much more mellow & soft compared to the days of the Enz where they were coming up with catchy, groovy songs of that era, so it would be best to leave Split Enz in that era because Crowded House had their moment too but they have come back 10 years later in a totally different era of music but it remains to be seen whether they can rediscover the creative spark from their heyday. I would say that 99.9% would not be able to pull off such a feat. It happens in all walks of life whether it be sport, entertainment, work, art or anything, they become the flavour of the month & someone else inevitably takes over the mantle because they are better at that particular time.

Enzboy.
The one thing we should never try to do is assume what events would have happened if history had have been different.
"If Phil had stayed, then the band would have imploded & moved on & we would not be witnessing today what we now call Crowded House."
Let's be realistic. Neil Finn has too much natural talent to assume that if he hadn't started off his career in his brother's band, that he would not have got to where he is today.

Tim Finn was not the be all and end all of Split Enz. And Neil's creative spark didn't actually spark until a couple of years after he joined. In those years in between what Tim did, however, was keep the band together after desperate and extremely low times. For that he should always be commended.

Neil's catchy tune I Got You was what brought the band into the mainstream public eye and to the top of the music charts for the first time, but it was not what kept them there.

That was a combined force of all members that made Split Enz, their look and their sound, a truly entertaining and great fun band that I loved and still love today.

But to stay on topic - I'm with the others. I'd love for them to re-unite every so often just for the fun of it, but I agree with Painaporo - they had a time and a place. Smiler
Kazzie wrote;
quote:
But to stay on topic - I'm with the others. I'd love for them to re-unite every so often just for the fun of it, but I agree with Painaporo - they had a time and a place.

I'm in this camp too. Big Grin

I loved Split Enz dearly, but would not like to hear a new album of songs. The guys have matured, changed, moved on. It would be clutching at straws and I think it would only serve to diminish the extremely strong legacy that they left.

If they reunite in the future, and I can do it, I'd go and see them anywhere. Smiler

But I would not want to see another album.
quote:
Originally posted by Texas Rose:
If they reunite in the future, and I can do it, I'd go and see them anywhere. Smiler

But I would not want to see another album.

I want to see this band make an album:
Tim Finn: Lead & Harmony Vocals, occasional backup guitar, piano & tambourine
Phil Judd: Lead & Harmony Vocals, Guitars
Eddie Rayner: Keys & Meaningful Looks
Noel Crombie: Sticks, Skins, Spoons & Meaningless Asides
Nigel Griggs: Bass. And All That That Entails

I want to see THAT BAND get together, gel, write, and make an album. No, I do not think they should call it Split Enz. But I think that it could be a powerfully creative musical unit that might savor a bit of some of the giddy excesses of old, but would also be free to take an entirely new lean & mean (or fat & nice for that matter) approach to whatever the best these boys can summon forth from within themselves brings!!!

Now as to touring, we all know Neil's and Tim's various endeavors occasionally do dip into the Enz tunes live. They were crucially involved in the creation of that music, and there's no reason why they can't play it and celebrate that. There's also no reason why this unit couldn't stack a fat concert set with the best of what suits them from that catalog as well - along with the new tunes they've come up with.

As far as the band's name, who really cares? They'd come up with something appropriate. The main thing is, these musicians have grown, and they shouldn't be expected or bound to make new "Split Enz" music.

Call me an idiot, but I believe they are capable of better than that. OK, maybe not better than the peakiest peaks, but certainly better than any self-conscious attempt to reclimb those same long-since-conquered climes.

Eh? Eh?

And I would LOVE to hear that new studio album! I just wouldn't want them to call it Split Enz.

EDIT: maybe they could call it 'Spilt Enz.'
quote:
Originally posted by Mr. Sadly:

I want to see this band make an album:
Tim Finn: Lead & Harmony Vocals, occasional backup guitar, piano & tambourine
Phil Judd: Lead & Harmony Vocals, Guitars
Eddie Rayner: Keys & Meaningful Looks
Noel Crombie: Sticks, Skins, Spoons & Meaningless Asides
Nigel Griggs: Bass. And All That That Entails


Replace Tim with Michael den Elzen and you have the original lineup of Schnell Fenster there.
quote:
Originally posted by Camus:
quote:
Originally posted by Mr. Sadly:

I want to see this band make an album:
Tim Finn: Lead & Harmony Vocals, occasional backup guitar, piano & tambourine
Phil Judd: Lead & Harmony Vocals, Guitars
Eddie Rayner: Keys & Meaningful Looks
Noel Crombie: Sticks, Skins, Spoons & Meaningless Asides
Nigel Griggs: Bass. And All That That Entails


Replace Tim with Michael den Elzen and you have the original lineup of Schnell Fenster there.

That might defeat...at least part of the purpose, though. Smiler Yet I admit, that was at least part of my mental justification for Griggs over Chunn.

EDIT: Essentially what I want to see is a Finn/Judd album, with a group of sidemen that are not mere sidemen, but that have the potential to alchemically alloy themselves together with the two principals to form a mighty and united juggernaut of KA-FUNK!!!!

The burgeoning legend of Spilt Zen is barely yet aborning.
quote:
Originally posted by Mr. Sadly:
EDIT: Essentially what I want to see is a Finn/Judd album, with a group of sidemen that are not mere sidemen, but that have the potential to alchemically alloy themselves together with the two principals to form a mighty and united juggernaut of KA-FUNK!!!!

The burgeoning legend of Spilt Zen is barely yet aborning.


That's what The Conversation album was going to be - Tim, Phil and Miles Golding (a founding member of Split Enz). Unfortunately due to tensions between Tim and Phil, Eddie Rayner replaced Phil.
quote:
Originally posted by Camus:
That's what The Conversation album was going to be - Tim, Phil and Miles Golding (a founding member of Split Enz). Unfortunately due to tensions between Tim and Phil, Eddie Rayner replaced Phil.

I love Golding's early work with the band, and I understand he's since become a respected professional, but I don't necessarily (no offense to Miles) deem him of equal mystique to some of those others in my dream combo.

See me snob.
quote:
Originally posted by Mr. Sadly:
quote:
Originally posted by Camus:
That's what The Conversation album was going to be - Tim, Phil and Miles Golding (a founding member of Split Enz). Unfortunately due to tensions between Tim and Phil, Eddie Rayner replaced Phil.

I love Golding's early work with the band, and I understand he's since become a respected professional, but I don't necessarily (no offense to Miles) deem him of equal mystique to some of those others in my dream combo.

See me snob.


He had a lot to do with the writing in the early days (even though he's not credited). Nearly all of Mental Notes was written while Golding was still in the band (I know Maybe was a new song barely finished when it was recorded but I'm sure Jaffa will tell me I'm totally wrong). One example is the guitar solo to Time For A Change - note for note Wally Wilkinson copied Golding's violin solo. Timbo and Philbo have both credited him with a lot in the early days.
quote:
Originally posted by Camus:
quote:
Originally posted by Mr. Sadly:
EDIT: Essentially what I want to see is a Finn/Judd album, with a group of sidemen that are not mere sidemen, but that have the potential to alchemically alloy themselves together with the two principals to form a mighty and united juggernaut of KA-FUNK!!!!

The burgeoning legend of Spilt Zen is barely yet aborning.


That's what The Conversation album was going to be - Tim, Phil and Miles Golding (a founding member of Split Enz). Unfortunately due to tensions between Tim and Phil, Eddie Rayner replaced Phil.


I thought that Tim and Phil were going to work on something before he recorded Imaginary Kingdom, which as Tim put in recent press was a move Phil interpreted as him not wanting to work with him whereas to Tim it was more a case of "when this is done".
quote:
Originally posted by Camus:
quote:
Originally posted by Mr. Sadly:
I love Golding's early work with the band, and I understand he's since become a respected professional, but I don't necessarily (no offense to Miles) deem him of equal mystique to some of those others in my dream combo.

See me snob.


He had a lot to do with the writing in the early days (even though he's not credited). Nearly all of Mental Notes was written while Golding was still in the band (I know Maybe was a new song barely finished when it was recorded but I'm sure Jaffa will tell me I'm totally wrong). One example is the guitar solo to Time For A Change - note for note Wally Wilkinson copied Golding's violin solo. Timbo and Philbo have both credited him with a lot in the early days.

That's definitely the impression I always got - that he was right in there surging and pulsing as an equal contributor to the sound and whimsy. I wasn't saying I put Wilkinson or Gillies ahead of him necessarily (not like I have a ranked list of Split Enz participants all vetted and checked!). There are a lot of people who contributed mightily, yet who I left out of my Enz Alumni dream team band.

As much as I respect Golding's stamp on the formative direction of the band we all know and love, I have to consider him a bit less "core" than the five I named above, in terms of what such a writing/performing unit could do for us today in a modernist rock and roll vein.
quote:
Originally posted by mummakook:
quote:
Originally posted by Camus:
quote:
Originally posted by Mr. Sadly:
EDIT: Essentially what I want to see is a Finn/Judd album, with a group of sidemen that are not mere sidemen, but that have the potential to alchemically alloy themselves together with the two principals to form a mighty and united juggernaut of KA-FUNK!!!!

The burgeoning legend of Spilt Zen is barely yet aborning.


That's what The Conversation album was going to be - Tim, Phil and Miles Golding (a founding member of Split Enz). Unfortunately due to tensions between Tim and Phil, Eddie Rayner replaced Phil.


I thought that Tim and Phil were going to work on something before he recorded Imaginary Kingdom, which as Tim put in recent press was a move Phil interpreted as him not wanting to work with him whereas to Tim it was more a case of "when this is done".


They were and Timbo still wanted to do it so it morphed into the Conversation. Miles Golding was always going to be involved.
quote:
Originally posted by Camus:
They were and Timbo still wanted to do it so it morphed into the Conversation. Miles Golding was always going to be involved.


That sounds very much like the scenario that developed prior to the recording of Imaginary Kingdom to me, because there was definitely a blow-up over Tim pulling the plug on something prior to the 2006 Australian Enz tour and in describing his falling out with Phil in various interviews as being because he let's say postponed any project with Phil to work on IK. The only part that doesn't fit is Miles definitely being involved, because I know that came to fruition after Miles visited New Zealand. Does this mean there's been another incident between them?
quote:
That sounds very much like the scenario that developed prior to the recording of Imaginary Kingdom to me, because there was definitely a blow-up over Tim pulling the plug on something prior to the 2006 Australian Enz tour and in describing his falling out with Phil in various interviews as being because he let's say postponed any project with Phil to work on IK. The only part that doesn't fit is Miles definitely being involved, because I know that came to fruition after Miles visited New Zealand. Does this mean there's been another incident between them?


I was talking about the pre IK thing, I'm sure Miles was involved in that, as I remember the talk about it being like a reunion of the original lineup of Split Ends.
quote:
I want to see this band make an album:
Tim Finn: Lead & Harmony Vocals, occasional backup guitar, piano & tambourine
Phil Judd: Lead & Harmony Vocals, Guitars
Eddie Rayner: Keys & Meaningful Looks
Noel Crombie: Sticks, Skins, Spoons & Meaningless Asides
Nigel Griggs: Bass. And All That That Entails


Oh yes I would too, I think they would be fine to call it Split Enz too. Personally I'd like to see Phil as the leader contributing 60-70% of the material, to give it that Enz quirk also with them trying to be equal there is more likely to be ego clashes.

As for Tim being Split Enz I don't think so, he needs at least Phil or Neil and Noel & Eddie. Phil was the early creative force. After Phil left Tim was the band leader, if anyone was, but Neil did write the big hits. Split Enz were always a BAND.
For me, Split Enz were essentially:

Tim Finn
Neil Finn
Eddie Rayner
Nigel Griggs
Noel Crombie

It didn't matter who came or left, as long as it wasn't one of the above.

I think Phil was a major part of the early Enz, but the Enz did carry on without him, although his place and importance within the band was openly acknowledged.

There have been quite a lot of members of Split Enz, and I think they all contributed to the Band and left their own indelible mark on it.

I don't think any one member was the Enz - it was made up of a group, and in fact I think the word "group" helped to define what Split Enz was.

Its been interesting reading all the posts in relation to this, but I still stand where I did when I last posted. Once a group has been broken up, the flow of what was the essence of that band is disrupted, or interrupted. I think it would be very hard to recapture that spirit.

Some people are saying that Crowded House have not managed to recapture the spirit this time around. CH for me is definitely different to what it was, but I'm not enjoying it any less because of that.

Perhaps I would find that if Split Enz were to get together and do another album, I'd be pleasantly surprised. I'd certainly buy it - there's no doubt about that.

I just think that the magic of the early days, which was decidedly waning towards the end (in my opinion) should be left intact in our hearts and minds.

I feel totally different to Split Enz getting back together to play the old songs - for me that recaptures the magic, and especially so on the ones which were co-written with Phil, and its a pleasure beyond expression to witness those shows.

But I would still feel wary of a completely new albut. Smiler
quote:
For me, Split Enz were essentially:

Tim Finn
Neil Finn
Eddie Rayner
Nigel Griggs
Noel Crombie

It didn't matter who came or left, as long as it wasn't one of the above.

I think Phil was a major part of the early Enz, but the Enz did carry on without him, although his place and importance within the band was openly acknowledged.

Texas Rose


Well I love that line up to, but like you I don't need any more. I'm quite happy with Tim solo and Crowded House and Finn Brothers. The reason i favour a Phil led Enz is that it would offer something different, I haven't got enough of that Judd/Finn combination, I'd love to hear Phil's edginess mitigated by some Finn pop. Still with a new Tim album and Love is a Moron coming there is nothing complain about.
OH MY GOD!

I appreciate that everybody is entitled to their opinion - I have championed this on several occasions, even when I have completely disagreed with what has been said - but... OH MY GOD!!!!

To say that Tim Finn is/was Split Enz is horrendously naive... it is often an unfortunate misconception that the person at the forefront of a band is the driving force behind it! In some cases, this would indeed be true! But not in this case! Tim was obviously a great front man for the band - extrovert, animated, good songwriter.... but the point is, you can't be in front of a band unless you have a band behind you! (?) I don't believe it was ever the Tim Finn Show! And if it had been, Split Enz would never have survived as long as they did! At their best they worked, lived, slept, ate and breathed as a band - a group of friends working as one!

As for a new album - hmmm! Torn on this one! I always agreed that they had their time and place, one which was pleasant to visit in times of nostalgic reminiscence, but I think with experiences and the passing of time any new material emerging from the collaboration of the SE that I know and love (Neil, Tim, Nigel, Eddie & Noel) would be nothing short of amazing - as long as it WAS a collaboration! i.e. 5 people, not 1! It's my firm belief that it took (at least!) 5 people to make SE what they were, and that would remain the same today!

But, of course, we wax lyrical - "ain't never gonna happen!"


More's the pity!
_________________________________

You're so damn pretty, and don't you know it.

I.R.C. - dancing guest of the stars!

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