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quote:
Originally posted by Lisaa:
[qb] I have a question, I don't know if it's already been discussed in this thread or elsewhere but, does anyone know why Paul was so depressed? And about what? What could have been so bad to have made him sink so low in the depths of his emotions?
[/qb]
i find it fascinating that nobody - here or in the media - has pointed out hessie's freely admitted love of pot and its medically proven link to exacerbating depressipn.

just a thought.

i don't imagine this will be a popular comment but i think it's fair to point out.
Depression is a terrible, terrible, evil disease of the brain which invades your thinking and thoughts and judgements, self worth and rationalisation and many people who suffer from depression and other mental illness do often find some relief in certainly cannabis and other mind altering drugs because it obviously eases the disturbed thought patterns, or possibly even calms and blocks them out - it is medicating, just as someone with physical pain would take medication, but unfortunately, these mental illnesses are caused by disturbed function of the many delicately interwoven brain chemicals and hormones, and cannabis and others do in fact contribute further to this imbalance - it's an evil and cruel catch 22 - it's a terrible illness that so often robs the world of much greatly loved people.
If we could all become more aware of depression and how it presents and quietly eats away at people then maybe we might be able to help someone, somewhere - awareness is always the first step to change.

RIP Paul - "...in the arms of the angels, may you find some comfort here."
I recently found out a friend of mine tried to commit suicide the same weekend that Paul died and it really made me stop and think.

My friend had never thought about killing herself before, even that day it was not something she planned. She had some family problems going on, thought she had worked through them but then when she was alone just thought to herself that she didn't want to carry on.

Thankfully her partner came home in time and she's now recovering, but it made me think what a knife edge someone who tries to kill themselves is on. She's alive to tell her tale, unfortunately no-one was there to help Paul in his darkest moment.

I guess I just learned, that not all suicides are planned, to plummet to those depths when death seems like the only answer can be a terrible momentary thing. I deeply hope that Paul has found his peace.

quote:
All alone I came into this world
All alone I will someday die
Solid stone is just sand and water, baby
Sand and water, and a million years gone by

I will see you in the light of a thousand suns
I will hear you in the sound of the waves
I will know you when I come, as we all will come
Through the doors beyond the grave
Hi, I haven't been on in a few weeks and the thread has grown so much! Everyone's comments are so touching and I can't thank everyone enough for them and their comfort.

To Nads and HalfFull, your posts were incredibly moving and your brave words have surely helped many who have been reading here. I thought I was getting a bit better but as I read your posts I found myself crying again. I guess my recent aversion to CH should have been a sign that I am still upset about Paul.

And to all those who were listening to Enz, CH and Finn playlists over the weekend of Paul's death, no one should be surprised at that, LOL! I finally got my hands on One All and had been listening to it religiously every single day for the last 2 months when I got the email that Paul had died. I don't know how all of you feel, but I have to listen to some Finn all the time, and it sounds like most of you are the same way. If my friends ever caught a peek at the play count of CH/Finn in my iTunes, they would think I was crazy, haha! I just can't help it...

It's so great to be able to come in here and see all the people who care about Paul and are still thinking about him. Here in the US, and esp. in NYC where I live, CH is almost never on the radio anymore and there were no memorials or tributes as in Australia. Hearing all the accounts of watching Hessie's Shed and the various tributes makes me wistful just a bit. It would have been so nice to see MTV2 have a day of tribute, but alas, that didn't happen.

So thanks again everyone and keep up the support! And again, my thoughts are with Paul's family and the extended Finn/Seymour clans, Mark Hart and Frenz of all sorts.
I would like to defend the people who asked why Paul was depressed and were very nicely told to mind their business.

Paul was a celebrity and the fact is, people like to speculate why celebrities do things. There were many articles analyzing Michael Hutchence's problems when he killed himself back in 1997--was it because of his fight with Bob Geldof? Was his death really accidental? And let's not get into all of the books and conspiracy theories about Kurt Cobain.

But, getting back on topic, Paul's suicide is especially troubling because unlike those other two, he seemed fairly stable. Clearly something went horribly wrong in his life that it had to end like this. Depression can be treated by many drugs and types of therapy today, but apparently he never found any that was effective, or chose not to pursue them further, as it was hinted at in some articles.

I hope to someday read or see on television, a sensitive, compassionate biography of him. So while it's not really OUR business to know what happened with him, I think much good can come of discussing possible causes, if not by US, then by trained psychiatrists.
I agree too. At least from my point of view, it is not gossip, but just trying to understand. I think all of us are learning something from these posts and many are sharing their dealing with depression, we are becoming more aware of the fragility of the mind and the care it requires. We are looking inside the human being, a condition we all share, and not the musician, which is for the gifted only. I wouldn't like to know his reasons if they are too intimate, but for example, in Michael Hutchence's case, I've recently read it was the battle for custody that finally pushed him.

Yesterday I dreamt of Paul for the first time. At first it was Paul and I asked him for the drumsticks so I could play a bit, but then his face was Neil's. I didn't want to disturb him, but had to say I was a CH fan and that I was sorry for what had happened, but that it was probably better not to talk about it as it'd be too painful to remind him. That's all I remember, I guess my mind was making the point of once somebody is gone, we should take care of the living.

I have been listening to CH a lot and downloading stuff from the internet. I finally discovered Together Alone and they stopped at a very interesting point in their music. They sounded much more mature with a bunch of inspiring and beautiful songs. Mark Hart's guitar is a great addition and the songs seem multidimensional, you can touch them, they are more like paintings. There is no need for videos.

There must be some point in the future when they get their recognition, should be up there with the best of the best.

Take care everybody
Everyone, I'd just like to say that my original intent in asking my question wasn't to be nosy, I'm not interested in what his personal, private business was, I was merely curious as to what would've driven him to that point, it's only natural to wonder why an otherwise happy person would commit suicide....I really didn't mean to get anyone's hackles up by simply asking the question...Peace
Hi everyone.

Just wanted to write and say that I was one of the ones that commented on the "why" of all this. It was never my intent to tell anyone to butt out. Thats not what I meant. I had just been reading some news articles about this whole situation and it was just sounding like some journalists were trying to put Paul in some box and making it sound like there was some trivial reason and I just dont think that people should be demanding to know why. But yes I agree totally that this issue needs to be looked into more and not just hidden away - thats the only way peoples lives can be saved. I never want anyone on this forum to be offended or hurt any further than they aready are so I'm sorry to anyone that may have felt this way. I'm just going thorugh the usual feelings - some days angry, some days sad. I'm currently in China for work at the moment and needed a last dose of CH before I left so I put on the sensational Try Whistling This by Neil Finn whilst I was packing and still couldnt even cope with listening to that. I soon found myself sitting on my bed with my clothes all around me just sobbing and sobbing for an hour. The last part of the last song just gets me - "we've come, so far". I used to listen to those words and think yes, how far you've all come but now those words mean something different. Anyway, just wanted to write and say sorry and to send a big hug to everyone.

Bye for now. xx
The crowds are still bustling,
it's pouring with rain.
I guess everything's normal -
but nothing's the same.
The world shifted sideways
by subtle degrees
When Paul finally thought
"Best for them, best for me".

It's so hard to accept
but we must understand -
there's no strength in the heart
of a suffering man.
Hindsight, as they say, is a
wonderful thing
But why dwell on the past,
on the "what might have been's"?

Forget the "how could he's", "why did he's"
and "what if's" and be thankful he stayed
for as long as he did.
Be thankful we helped him see glorious days
when the demons within were kept firmly at bay.

Time now to remember,
to look back and grin.
Our task to reflect,
let the healing begin.
There's so much to treasure
in picture and song.
You were one in a million -
Rest in peace, Paul. So long.


I've been trying my best to put this terrible loss into words as beautiful as the rest of you have managed but when words fail I always seem to resort to simple rhymes. I wrote this during a period of acceptance but right now I just want to turn the clock back, grab him by the shoulders and yell "A world of people will cry rivers because of this - wake up and smell the roses, you silly twat!!".

I read that the cycle of grief is Shock, Denial, Anger, Despair and Acceptance. We may go through the cycle once or many times before we finally do accept that someone we love has gone. I lost my Nan last year and my Aunt earlier this year but Paul's loss has hit me much harder because it was so unexpected. I think it's important for everyone to remember that we deal with loss in different ways and recover from it at different times. If people need to ask questions, let them ask. If people want to rant, let them. The chances are there's someone reading the forum who feels the same way but can't express themselves so openly.

Lastly, my thoughts are with each and every one of you but especially with Paul's family and friends - they bare the hardest weight of all. There really aren't enough words in the world for times like these but I hope that the wave of love and appreciation for Paul has gone some small way to bringing comfort to those who knew him best.
Such beautiful words Emmamay.....perhaps, the most beautiful I've read so far. You've conveyed EVERYTHING, well done! You under-estimate the power of your poetry....tears are falling yet again! I guess I'm not quite as 'over' the whole thing as I thought, but that's OK. It all takes time.

Every day I am simply bewildered by the magical personal and musical memories that Paul has left us...we were SO lucky to have him!

What a man.....what an absolute legend! Big Grin
I joined this forum very soon after the news about Paul... But didnt know what to say... too sad I guess. I can only re iterate what everyone has said and how wonderful Paul and the Crowdies are. I heard this tragic news on my honeymoon from Mark Seymour on Bert Newton (GMA) and could not believe it....
My hubby though someone in the family had died! I still cant believe it...i know this is my 1st and only post so far but I have been a huge CH fan since 1986 when i was 13 and I turned 30 yesterday!!! I can tell you that I will have the Crowdies blaring loud tomorrownight and have already warned the neighbours!

Hessie was my favorite, I thought he was the biggest spunk ever.. such an infectious smile, so funny and I loved the way he seemed to take over the live shows (although i only got to 1)...... but he was awesome. I will NEVER forget Hessie and I love him for all that he contributed to life, music and anything else he was involved in. LUV u mate!!!

I have to say i so love listening to their live performances... and I agree with many members how painful it is to watch the FTTW concert when DDIO is on and how sad paul is.. breaks my heart....

Best wishes and absolute love go out to his family and his gorgeous girls! and of course you guys!

Lea xoxoxo
I have just for the first time been able to face playing Italian Plastic and of course the tears are back again!!!
Paul, you will always be 'my man from the moon' ... thank you!
ps. does anyone remember when he first sang that on Saturday Morning Live with Johnno and Dano ... very funny and very raw version...... he actually played his brushes on a cardboard box and ended up smashing the box to pieces ... gosh, so long ago now!!!!! xxxx
quote:
Originally posted by KD:
[qb] ps. does anyone remember when he first sang that on Saturday Morning Live with Johnno and Dano ... very funny and very raw version...... he actually played his brushes on a cardboard box and ended up smashing the box to pieces ... gosh, so long ago now!!!!! xxxx [/qb]
Oh I'd forgotten all about that, but I remember so well now!! Thanks KD for reminding me of yet another brilliant Hessie moment, bless him.
quote:
Originally posted by Emmamay:
[qb] shoulders and yell "A world of people will cry rivers because of this - wake up and smell the roses, you silly twat!!".

I read that the cycle of grief is Shock, Denial, Anger, Despair and Acceptance. We may go through the cycle once or many times before we finally do accept that someone we love has gone.. [/qb]
Yes thankyou Emmamay - you really nailed some emotions for me. Smiler

And the cycle of grief thing, I hadn't learnt about that but it makes perfect sense. Despair is certainly the word I would use to describe many moments that drew me to this forum particularly, in the last few weeks.

However, I *am* constantly amazed by Paul's legacy - my 5yo has now built his own cardboard drumkit and apparently started his 1st band with his 2yo sister. His favourite band is officially CH so, naturally, "We do the Crowdies' songs Mum" Smiler

Annie
quote:
Originally posted by Emmamay:
[qb] I read that the cycle of grief is Shock, Denial, Anger, Despair and Acceptance. We may go through the cycle once or many times before we finally do accept that someone we love has gone. [/qb]
I think I got it a bit the wrong way round, or maybe I'm just alternating. This past week has been denial I think - it just doesn't seem real and when I remind myself that it is it's like a punch in the head. I've not been angry, I just can't, it's too sad. The tears have been fewer this week, but they're still lurking. My uncle died suddenly last August and although I had my moments when I totally lost it, I'm sure it didn't feel this bad. Why is that?

Tonight I got my brand spanking new One All in the mail, listened to Lullaby Requiem and promptly lost it again.

Still looking at the sky every night and asking why.
I still feel so sad for Hessie...he had so much to live for and had so many people that love him. He made us laugh and touched us all with his music and personality, and he was lovable family guy, and out of nowhere, he's just gone. It's so hard to deal with. I'm still finding myself weeping when listening to Crowded House. Crowded House have always been my favourite band and I'm a huge fan of Neil, Nick and Paul. This might sound stupid but it's like a part of me is gone. Sorry if I'm just blabbering on and being silly, but this is the only place where I can vent my thoughts.
david_19, I completely understand. The hardest part is unless you are surrounded by people who feel the same (which I'm not), you kind of feel that you have to supress your emotions to a certain degree.
It's nice to be able to come here and share thoughts and realise that you aren't the only person feeling despair.
Losing Paul has brought back so many memories from my teenage years (I'm now 33) and I think that is also quite hard to deal with - it's a time that can never be recaptured and now with Paul gone, that realisation hits even harder.
david_19, you're not on your own. It's hard when there are so many people who don't understand how we're feeling. I can't remember when I last cried so much and I only met Paul once. The thing is that when a band is such a huge part of your life, losing a member of that band is like losing a part of yourself. Every time I think about Hessie I feel like my heart's been ripped out.

'He's only halfway through his life
He only used up all his time'
Oh how the loss of innocence of life weighs heavily upon my heart. How wonderful, mysterious and warm life seemed when we were young, but time has now past, and Paul has also now gone. Without Paul in it, life doesn't seem as colourful and warm as it use to be, a large becon of light has gone out. In time our hearts will mend and become filled with love, compassion and understanding again. Until then, embrace each other as a family, as we all need the love, support and understanding from those who grieve.

You have to have rain before you see a rainbow.

Niss xo

All I ask... is to live each moment... free from the last
It's been four weeks and it is still so fresh in my mind, today I watching the Max Sessions, the one with John Mayer and Hessie said something completely random, the nature of which is now escaping my mind, but for the first time since hearing I laughed my ass off instead of crying and insted of thinking about how sad it is that he is gone, I thought about how glad I am that these little moments of Hessie just running off at the mouth about some completely random topic exist for public consumption and that being able to make people laugh (especially me, who is a) suffering from a severe infection and is in a lot of pain and b) has being feeling really down all week, unrealated to the infection) is a really great legacy and once the sadness finally passes or eases there will always be something great to remember him by.

Thankyou Paul.
quote:
Originally posted by frozencharlotte:
[qb] It's been four weeks and it is still so fresh in my mind[/qb]
*Nods*

This morning, my sister, when flipping through the channels to see what was on, came across the Wiggles and decided to watch that. And wouldn't you know it, the minute she turned it there, what was the first thing I saw on the screen? Paul, singing and acting goofy along with the Wiggles (they weren't doing the fruit salad song, though, they were doing that potato song and Paul would wander by every so often holding a plate full of food and singing something). Kinda affected my good mood there for a brief time.

Angela
quote:
The hardest part is unless you are surrounded by people who feel the same (which I'm not), you kind of feel that you have to supress your emotions to a certain degree.
Quote by KD
I agree comepletely. Paul's death has been an almost overwhelming event in my life, yet it means almost nothing to the people around me. I'm exhausted from hiding my emotions for the better part of each day until there's privacy enough to crack. That's why I'm spending far too much time at work logged on to this forum - it's the only connection I have to people who are feeling the exact same emotions as me at the exact same time. Without you guys the world would be a very lonely place right now so thanks to everyone for being there.
quote:
Originally posted by silent stream:
[qb]
quote:
Originally posted by Lisaa:
[qb] I have a question, I don't know if it's already been discussed in this thread or elsewhere but, does anyone know why Paul was so depressed? And about what? What could have been so bad to have made him sink so low in the depths of his emotions?
[/qb]
i find it fascinating that nobody - here or in the media - has pointed out hessie's freely admitted love of pot and its medically proven link to exacerbating depressipn.

just a thought.

i don't imagine this will be a popular comment but i think it's fair to point out. [/qb]
Silent Stream is absolutely correct! I kept waiting for someone to bring it up. Pot is so much more damaging than people think--- it just takes a LOT longer to see it than other drugs. And quitting, especially after long term use, can be really dangerous because the depression is SO profound for at least the first six months. I know, I sound like a huge square, but the research is out there and I hope one day that the use of pot and its' true effects will be more widely understood. This is not a "It's his own fault for using drugs" deal, honest. I just wish more people knew about this, and depression in general. End of sermon.
Dear Paul,

Ugh, what to say? It�s been nearly a month since you left this material world. What a long month it�s been! Not a day has gone by that you haven�t crossed my mind. After reading all of the posts in this forum, sadly I feel like I know you more now than ever. I hesitated posting all this time, but when I had a wonderful dream of you last night, I woke up with a warm feeling and decided it�s time to add my thoughts.

Thank you for all the joy and the memories you gave, and still give, to me. Your body has come to its final rest, but your spirit is all around. It�s in airdrumming along with your records, in long fits of laughter, in a good cup of tea. You left us such a legacy, with your immeasurable talent and unforgettable personality.

I�m saving up to come to Melbourne in January for your birthday, to celebrate your life in the land you love. My sympathies and best wishes to your family and friends. You are so special. You go on and on�

Thinking of you and smiling,
Shannon
Emmamay,
I am with you, I only have to read one post on this forum dedicated to Paul, and I have to squeeze down any overwhelming emotion. It seems silly to me to a degree, because, honestly, I didn't know him at all, but... I still feel the blood rush up into my head and my eye's start burning. Yet, no one sees me cry.

I cry alot believe me! (I could pass it off as something else... ha!) Or just be honest.
My man was giving me crap after still crying for my favourite dog six months after he died. That one is still raw too and it is over two years now.

I think everyone has a right to be sad in their own way.

The comment about pot, yes it has been proven it's links to depression, and maybe I have been a "big square" too, wontgivein, but I generally haven't taken any drugs in my life for the fear of what it might do to me in 10 or so years. I don't know, if you are even a little prone to being low, as some of us can, it probably isn't a good idea. But what is done is done.
Can't Believe it four weeks since Paul passed away.In those four weeks i have thought alot about things in my life and have decided to change stuff and try and live life alittle more.As a way of honouring paul i have bought a guitar and took up lessons and iam determined to learn italian plastic!I never bothered before cause i have always been to busy but now i realise that life does not last long and u got to do the things u love now.

I have watched farewell to the world so many times and still tears comes to the eye when u see Paul during sister madley and at the end when don't dream plays out.

I am still coming to the forum every night and reading these posts and they have really helped me and i'd like to thank everyone here.I use alot of forums but i think this one has something really speical going on.

Roger
RIP Paul
Hard to believe it's a month since we lost Hessie Frowner

I have my good days and bad days - lost it two weeks ago when I was writing some memoirs and it got too much - I think I was crying for 10 minutes.

But coming here has been great therapy for me, I feel I express my emotions without people thinking I'm obsessed. (My friends have been understanding, thank goodness.)

Thanks everyone for listening.
quote:
Originally posted by Crowdieman:
[qb] nice pic of Neil singing disco.Is it from seven worlds concerts?

Roger
RIP Paul [/qb]
Thanks for the compliment!

I think it is - I should check out the link!

Good to see how Hessie inspired you to play guitar - he's inspiring me to change my outlook on a few things.
I saw Tina Turner performing one of her songs on Oprah last week (I think it was Better Be Good To Me). I just couldn't help laughing the whole time, and I don't think I will be able to watch her again without laughing, cause it brings up the image of FTTW where Paulo does his Tina for us. If I did'nt know any better, I would have sworn that Tina was imitating Paulo and not the other way around.
Indeed already a month ago since he left us, I almost can't believe it, but it feels good that the joyable memories are slowly taking over the feelings of shock.
Discosquirrel - your avatar image is from the Linda McCartney memorial show at the RAH (note the pass Neil is wearing around his neck - he kept it on all the time, as if he thought no-one would know who he was otherwise Smiler ). It's odd, the only two shows I've been to at the RAH were that one and the recent Finn Brothers gigs. Both sad occasions in their way, but the Linda memorial didn't feel that way to me, it was a celebration of her life. Maybe one day there will be a similar show for Paul, when the shock has subsided a little and we are left with just the many good memories of him. I wonder if Paul McCartney (or Ringo, one of Paul's heroes) might return the compliment?
quote:
Originally posted by alucidor:
[qb] Discosquirrel - your avatar image is from the Linda McCartney memorial show at the RAH (note the pass Neil is wearing around his neck - he kept it on all the time, as if he thought no-one would know who he was otherwise Smiler ). It's odd, the only two shows I've been to at the RAH were that one and the recent Finn Brothers gigs. Both sad occasions in their way, but the Linda memorial didn't feel that way to me, it was a celebration of her life. Maybe one day there will be a similar show for Paul, when the shock has subsided a little and we are left with just the many good memories of him. I wonder if Paul McCartney (or Ringo, one of Paul's heroes) might return the compliment? [/qb]
Ah, that's where it was from - I taped the concert telecast when it was on 6 years ago - must check it out!

That would be great if Ringo and Paul did a concert for Hessie Smiler
Silent stream wrote that Paul had a freely admitted love of pot.
Pot has been shown to exacerbate depression. This much is true. Unfortunately, depression is something that is difficult to admit to because it comes with so many negative labels and connotations. People are thought of as failures if they admit to being depressed. Rather than seek qualified medical attention for their illness, people suffering with depression find it easier to self-medicate. Many people do it with pot, many do it with alcohol, I'm convinced that many of our narcotic addicts are so inclined because of depression.
Depression not only sucks, IT HURTS! And it hurts like hell.
I've battled the same demon. I remember telling my grandmother that I was taking anti-depressants. When she asked why, I freely admitted that it was (hopefully) to stop me from killing myself. She called me a failure.
Can you fathom that? I was a failure for taking anti-depressant medication. Would that have made me a winner had I gone through with the thoughts that were with me all day and all night for days at a time?
Unfortunately, my grandma's reaction is not an isolated one. It's very hard to admit that you've reached that point. It's very hard to admit defeat and ask for help.
Until we can change society's attitude towards depression, more people like our beloved Paul will take the road that leads them away from us permanently. The stats currently state that 210 Australians attempt suicide everyday. 7 of those people succeed. One of those people was Paul Hester, the man so loved by so many.
If nothing else, think about the way that you view depression. Accept that it is a part of our lives and that it is nothing to be ashamed of. Reach out to someone you think may be suffering - don't wait for them to come to you. It's just too bloody hard.
And educate your kids about pot. I personally think it's crap that it leads to harder drugs, but I do think it does more harm than good. THC (the active in Pot) gets stored in fat cells. Your brain is mostly fat. Still don't think it messes with your mind? Guess Again.
Nads000, I am not ashamed of depression, I think I am quite sensitive about it as the moody person that I am. I think most of my friends, my dearest ones, take depression seriously, but I also feel it is the older generation that sees it as a weakness instead of a mental illness or whatever you want to call it. It's such a an ugly word for it,'mental illness'...

I don't believe in psycoanalysis or psychiatry, but I believe in psychology and other kinds of therapy. Each person has to find their right method and the right person. Apart from that, I guess I've learnt that after a bad day, there's a high chance the next will be good, it has happened so many times before, everybody should keep that thought in mind when it gets tough.

It's been over a month since Paul did what he did, and I'm still basically listening to CH only. Tomorrow I'm going to the Spanish F1 GP and I'm taking all six albums for the long bus trip. We've been having rain for the last 3 days and it's perfect for my mood, but I know by Friday it will be sunny in Barcelona...
Why does it all still seem so hard ..... is it strange that everyday I wake up and think of Paul and wonder why??? Thoughts of him are still coming to me throughout the day and now, even more so than when it first happened, it is so difficult to cope with because I am finding it increasing difficult to talk about it to anyone.
I am coming to Melbourne next weekend and I am going to raise a glass in the Prince of Wales for Paul .... bless my hubby, he will also, even though he was never into CH and doesn't really understand.
I can't imagine what it must be like for those who were close to him... xxxxx

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