Officially lost Enz recordings

"Last Late Night" must be a cursed song ... I understand Mushroom has managed to lose the original master tapes of the audio AND video. Good thing second-generation copies still exist.

I gather that some of the re-recordings of Reefer Derci Caberet are missing too, I presume it's Time For A Change, as that's on the LP, but not on oddz and enz.

Have Mushroom lost the master of History Never Repeats as well (The best of album, not the song) becasue the 7" version of LLN was on that originally, or is that what you mean by second generation flicker? I guess it would be as the master for the album would be compiled from individual song masters making it second generation.... I'll get my coat. Hang on, when was History Never Repeats released originally, 1989? Surely Mushroom would have had DAT or something digital to avoid generation loss.

Hmm, I'm sure I read somewhere that the version of LLN on the HNR comp had to be taken from vinyl because the master tape was lost. That's what I meant by 2nd generation.

Geez, mastered from a vinyl source on the CD?? They must have been desperate It's a very clean transfer if it is (admittedly I haven't heard it in a while).

Ditto for some of the older tracks on Other Enz, I believe.

Yes, one of the Swingers tracks is taken from a vinyl source, and sounds pretty ordinary, that girlfriend song of Tim's is from a very ropey sounding cassette and I think The Instrumental is from a vinyl source as well. I don't remember LLT on HNR comp sounding as bad as those though (as I said, haven't listened to it in years... I much prefer the Second Thoughts version... just waiting for Semi-detached to turn up now )

I believe a concert in Wellington (1979??) that was videotaped has major problems with the broadcast masters, which is why none of it was on the Enz DVD. Of course, there are numerous countdown appearances which have no broadcast master anymore, for example Maybe and No Bother To Me from 1975.

The 7" version of 'Late Last Night' on the original 1989 release of the Mushroom History Never Repeats album is definitely mastered from vinyl. Stylus crackle is noticably audible at the start and finish of the track. A shame that the master tape is missing.

How about the 7" mixes of the pre-Mental Notes singles? Do the masters for these still exist?

And, in response to my good friend Camus, I'm going in to bat for the Ernie Rose XI!

I mention on the Enzology site that I couldn't locate the 1972/3 "Time for A Change" demo recorded by Phil and Miles (as heard in the background in the 1976 "SplitEnded Wireless Special"). Tried for seven years to find this! Rang and emailed everybody I could think of.

Same with the very first Split Ends recording, the "Let Suzuki Blow Your Mind" radio commercial. Long gone, that one, though Wally did sing it for me. I was very impressed that he remembered it, especially as he wasn't even in the band when it was recorded.

The 1975 Mandrill Studios demos master tape is missing for now. I think it'll turn up sooner or later. The cassette copy that Mike made in the 90s is missing, presumed stolen... along with the car it was sitting in.

The BBC Dave Lee Travis tapes are music only. I haven't found decent masters of the John Peel session.

I haven't asked, but I would imagine that the "Time for a Change" Reefer Cabaret recording still exists but was left off Oddz and Enz due to the rough sound quality of the vocal recording. It was considered for inclusion, initially.

Many pre-mid 80s NZ music recordings no longer exist on tape. Record companies literally dumped them due to lack of storage. Possibly the same in Australia. The nostalgia market didn't fully kick in until the late '80s and the CD boom. These days, I'm surprised when I heard a CD of a '60s or '70s NZ music recording that isn't mastered from vinyl. I'd also be surprised if the very early Split Ends single mixes still existed. I didn't search through Festival Mushroom Records' tape archives, so I don't know what's there.

For Enzology, I declicked a good 7" copy of the "Late Last Night" single and it sounds very good. Wish they'd used this in the "Split Enz" DVD.

I've mentioned here before my disappointment in the transfer of "The Instrumental" on "Other Enz". It's from a tape which sounds to me like a poorly dubbed cassette. Again, I've got an original 7" vinyl copy of this and it sounds sooo much better than what ended up on the CD. Got cymbals on it and everyfin!

Back on topic - missing tapes. There are rumours that the stereo master tapes of one or two Enz albums have gone walkies. I won't mention which ones... These things happen. Even the "Sgt Pepper's" master tape was missing when the CD was being mastered in 1987. They had to use a safety copy. The master has since been found again, so there's some hope for the Enz albums.

For Enzology, I'd really hoped to use Paul Hester's cassette recordings of his Split Enz audition and the apparently hilarious vocal overdub out-takes from "One Mouth Is Fed". He hasn't found them, unfortunately.

Paul Crowther thought he had a cassette of "Second Thoughts" rough mixes but this also proved elusive.

For every tape that can't be found, many forgotten ones have turned up, so it's not all bad news. Some surprises to come, methinks.

Jaffa

It would seem that a lot has been lost from this era of the enz. I remember reading that they had many demo-ed songs that could not make it onto albums because of re-recording Mental Notes. Chunn refers to many songs played live but never recorded. I would imagine that if they existed they would be on the Enzology series.

Of course there is nothing stopping them getting together and recording them now but thats another story.

Hey Incognito...for the band's 10th anniversary, Tim had wanted to get all the past Enz members together with the 5 guys in the band at the time (Dec 1982) to do a big concert. There was a live album and movie planned. Alas, only Mike Chunn, Rob Gillies and Paul Crowther turned up, and the Enz Of An Era shows that did eventuate had a mixed reaction from the crowd. I assume that new live renditions of past classics would have been recorded had Tim's idea gone ahead. I know that there was a mini-set of 5 Enz oldies performed.

Anyway, I digress...I recall Peter Green saying that a lot of Enz masters were lost after Mushroom poorly stored them during the '80s and '90s, and then a flood in the storage area finished many off. So we were mega-lucky to ever get the likes of the Reefer Cabaret tracks and 'Nightmare Stampede'.

Yes, having heard the Sweetwater reunion show, the crowd seemed very unappreciative of the older material. They actually boo when Tim says they're going back to 1973 and kick into Split Ends, there is a lot of crowd talk through Jamboree, they're very restless through Stranger Than Fiction and Time For A Change causing Tim to comment that they obviously aren't interested so they'll go straight to My Mistake (according to STF this is where Tim pulled the plug on Another Great Divide, apparantly much to Paul Crowther's disgust).

I don't think Mushroom ever had the Auckland concert that Nightmare Stampede is from, I'm sure Jaffa will correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that concert is actually an audience recording held by Eddie Rayner.

I've always wondered what was lost from that Mushroom warehouse, I do remember Peter saying that they had to literally microwave the tapes to get them to play (I always thought they were the Reefer Derci tapes, don't know why).

Here's a question for you all, why do we like this band so much we rhapsodise about what we'll probably never hear? It's a bit like all those missing Doctor Who episodes....

You're right, Camus. The Reefer Cabaret tracks had to be microwaved, plus 'Nightmare Stampede' (and 'True Colours') were from an audience recording, not Mushroom - at His Majesty's Theatre, Auckland, 19 Feb 1976 during the Enz Of The Earth tour if my somewhat random memory serves me correctly!

Is it me or is there looped audience noise at the end of Nightmare Stampede? Listen for someone yell "Woo hoo!" and then, seconds later, it appears again sounding exactly the same!

Jaffa, would you ever be likely to be in a position where record companies would just give you carte blanche to search through their archives, to attempt to find missing recordings, or just see what's there?

I think that someone who appreciates the music would have an edge over someone who drew the short straw on what could well be a very tedious job.

It would be interesting to know what has possibly been stacked away, just waiting to be re-discovered

Possibly. With Eddie gradually remastering the catalogue, I'm hoping I'll be allowed to help with suggestions for extra tracks. We'll see if Enzology's ABC broadcast in Australia stirs up more interest, from the public and the record companies, in all thing Enz.

I know that FMR occasionally sent tapes to Peter Green to store away over the years. When I visited Paul Hester a couple of years ago, he was about to audition a multi-track tape of a live 1979 Enz concert for Peter. Paul was one of those rare people with a 24 track Otari tape machine in his back shed recording studio! I never did get to hear that tape, though...
I wouldn't mind going through Peter's tape archives sometime.

Did you say ABC Broadcast in Australia ????? When's that Jaffa please, the little pods will be working overtime.

Several people seem to have missed Jaffaman's announcement of the Enzology repeat broadcasts, I've made that thread a "sticky" topic.

Brilliant idea there Flicker. Ta muchly

Jaffa,

Did Mike Chunn ever describe the Mandrill demos or tell you what was recorded?

Is this where the acoustic Under The Wheel sung in dual harmony is from (not that I've ever heard it, I've heard of it).

Also, how many other early home demos like the ones for Late Last Night still survive?