NEWS: Nick Seymour Slams Neil Finn

Hi Secret God, I'm glad you came back

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I guess you're happy to have people add to your song & not be credited

That isn't what I said. I said if someone wrote part of the song then yes I would credit them (by this I mean a song credit, as they have written part of the song). If they play on the song, then I would credit them as a player on the song, but not a song credit as they didn't write part of the song. This is standard practice, and perfectly fair IMO.

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but it's my opinion that as long as Neil Finn is present, beautiful music will be made

Maybe. Having listened to both TWT live club discs it sounds very flat and uncomfortable, and doesn't sound like a band playing, but Neil Finn with some session musicians. This is of course subjective, and entirely my opinion

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BTW, I'm all for Neil Finn (for example) getting sole credit on HIS dongs on either of the Finn Brothers albums - IF he wrote them... & I find it hard to believe both brothers had equal imput into every song...

Well, I hope Neil doesn't put his dong all over the songs... ok seriously Surely this is a contradiction? If Tim added lyrics and maybe part of the verse or chorus or bridge (ok, bridge is unlikely, Neil is the king of bridges) then he should get a song writing credit as he has actually written part of the song. I don't understand why you feel Nick should receive song writing credits for playing bass and paul for playing drums, but Tim doesn't get a writing credit for actually writing some of the song. Don't you like Tim? ( )

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What I did find hard to believe is that Neil Finn apparently didn't write the famous solo in don't dream it's over... & with that part being a major part of the song & making him millions of dollars...

I have the demo of DDIO, and the chords for the solo are there, but no solo. So Neil wrote the foundations of the solo, and Mitchell Froom improvised a solo using Neil's melody as a basis, therefore, he shouldn't get a writing credit, as this is the same as me playing a guitar solo on Fingers of Love.

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the whole "band unity" doesn't really do much for me.

You've obvioulsy never played in a band. Without unity it is a horrible soul destroying experience, and I speak from having been in a band for three years without any unity. In the end I did a Phil Judd (verbally though, i didn't punch anyone) and also did what he did, which was to play out the tour and leave.

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When I said that, I didn't mean it to be taken so seriously

Bit hard to tell, sorry.....

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I guess I just look up to Neil Finn as God & don't believe anyone else has any talent!

I'd started to figure that If you want to look into someone who IS a complete control freak who doesn't credit anyone for writing part of the songs, check out Robert Fripp and King Crimson, they're still around.

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Well the songs regularly DO sound similar live...

Well, from the same tour I'd agree, but if you listen to the first album tour then the Temple of Lowmen Tour, then the Woodface tour then the Together Alone tour, the same songs do sound quite different between tours. A great example is Love You Till The Day I Die, I have heard about ten live versions, not one sounds the same.

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Do you seriously think "Finn/Seymour/Hester/Hart" had enough input into kare kare to warrant them all a c-songwriting credit?

Yes, because I know Kare Kare was written as a band jam, therefore it is quite right that everyone has a writing credit. This is different to Neil bringing in a completed song and the band working out an arrangement.

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The basslines on that (played by Neil) are nothing like Nick Seymour's CH basslines.
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Possibly. I like the whole raw feel to it, so I wouldn't mind if the bass wasn't up to scratch.

It seems you've missed my point, which was that everytime I have heard Neil Finn play a bassline, they are nothing like Nick Seymours, and if Neil waas writing all the basslines in CH, then logically when he plays bass lines they should sound like Nick Seymour, if Neil dictated the bass parts to Nick.

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Well there's 2 new words for me! I still don't know what you're known for, but it sounds interesting.

You could look them up in the dictionary

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I don't understand why you feel Nick should receive song writing credits for playing bass and paul for playing drums, but Tim doesn't get a writing credit for actually writing some of the song. Don't you like Tim? ( )

Hey Camus. I never said this. I've never said anyone else should be credited for Neil's songs, let alone the bass player. Weather or not Nick did write the bass lines or not, I still don't believe he (Nick) should be credited as a co-songwriter (you would be correct in not crediting your bassist who even "wrote" the bass lines)... but no, I don't hate Tim ( )... & think he should always be credited for what he wrote, as should Tim. All I was emplying is that each brother wouldn't have had equal imput into those songs (IMO)... & Neil / Tim should have perhaps not done a Lennon / McCartney & had every song in those sessions (bar last day of june) credited as "Finn / Finn". Having said that, IF each brother did actually have a hand in writing, not just performing each song, then I'm not comlpaining.

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I have the demo of DDIO, and the chords for the solo are there, but no solo. So Neil wrote the foundations of the solo, and Mitchell Froom improvised a solo using Neil's melody as a basis...

Well then I guess Mitchell Froom probably doesn't deserve any credit. As I said before, I don't know the story about that - I just thought, from what you were saying, that Mitchell Froom actually created that solo. And with that solo being so awesome, *maybe* he could have possibly got a co-write for it, but not definitley.

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You've obvioulsy never played in a band. Without unity it is a horrible soul destroying experience, and I speak from having been in a band for three years without any unity...

Your assumption that I have never been in a band is... correct (phew?) & maybe if I were in a band, I might like some sort of unity (fair enough), but that doesn't mean I have to respect the unity of Crowded House (which I actually do, but I love Neil solo just as much).

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...In the end I did a Phil Judd (verbally though, i didn't punch anyone) and also did what he did, which was to play out the tour and leave.

So your band actually went on tour? Interesting. Pity about you leaving though (You don't have to discuss it if you feel the post might be deleted for not being on topic).

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If you want to look into someone who IS a complete control freak who doesn't credit anyone for writing part of the songs, check out Robert Fripp and King Crimson, they're still around.

Once again, have never heard of them (shame on me), but thanks for the tip (not that I want my idol to be a control freak though... )

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...but if you listen to the first album tour then the Temple of Low men Tour, then the Woodface tour then the Together Alone tour, the same songs do sound quite different between tours.

There are so many live shows I still haven't listened to yet ( - will get around to it), and I certaintly HAVE heard different versions of songs, but I haven't gone as far as to think about how it sounded different yet, sorry.

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A great example is Love You Till The Day I Die, I have heard about ten live versions, not one sounds the same.

Well the version from Newcastle, Australia from 20th March 1992 certaintly sounds different! I'll give you that. I'll listen to other versions when I sort out what i've got.

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...I know Kare Kare was written as a band jam, therefore it is quite right that everyone has a writing credit.

I was unaware of that. Fair enough about that though. You win that one .

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...everytime I have heard Neil Finn play a bassline, they are nothing like Nick Seymours, and if Neil was writing all the basslines in CH, then logically when he plays bass lines they should sound like Nick Seymour...

I honestly can't tell them apart. Not saying they're not different, I generally just don't notice how different the bass lines are in Finn related songs.

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[qb]Secert God:[/qb]
Well there's 2 new words for me! I still don't know what you're known for, but it sounds interesting.

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[qb]Camus:[/qb]
You could look them up in the dictionary

Nah, dictionary.com has too many ads! . I guess I will never know.

Mmmm.....interesting technique breaking down each others posts and commenting on it in detail.

Can we get back on topic here at all? As in Nick's alleged comments?

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Originally posted by tonguetied:
[qb] Mmmm.....interesting technique breaking down each others posts and commenting on it in detail.[/qb]

Why thank you .

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Originally posted by tonguetied:
[qb] Can we get back on topic here at all? As in Nick's alleged comments? [/qb]

I think we all took the (original specific) topic (which I started) as far as it could go (without milking it completely dry)... although we're still basing our posts on Neil & Nick and above all, talking specificly about Crowded House - in detail.

Of course, me, Camus and co. could all be discussing what we ate for breakfast this morning or discussing who our favourite supermodel is (in this forum) - and if that were the case, I'd admit to being off topic & take it to All I Ask, but as a moderator here, I don't see much wrong with the natural progression of this thread. However if you're not happy, you can close the thread or move it to the mods forum.

Back on topic: Um... so... I've still go that Herald Sun newspaper article I cut out. I actually laminated it, as I do every other article... Um... g2g, cya.

No problem at all this end if you're happy . Unfortunately in the UK we get nothing worthy of laminating about the Finns.

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Mmmm.....interesting technique breaking down each others posts and commenting on it in detail.

It's called an exchange of opinions, what i thought the whole point of this board was about.

How is this off topic? It's still based against what Secret God originally said, it's still about Nick Seymour and Crowded House. How is analysing the music of CH off topic in a CH forum? I guess we could all go back to I heard X CH song in starbucks, wasn't Neil's hair lovely in such and such, Neil is God etc... pretty boring and totally pointless. I guess I'll go back to the Split Enz forum, seems more tolerant. Sorry Secret God, I was enjoying this discussion.

Verbose means I talk a lot. Tenacity means I don't let go. Try a paper dictionary, they're easier to use And it's imply

Can we PLEASE kill the sarcasm and pissing contest? I think that was TongueTied's point, but I'll try making it again.

Keep it on topic. If Camus and SG want to dissect each other, some of that is probably best off the forum and not in public.