Lightsleeper Fan Reviews

Mariola posted:
Whysus posted:
Mariola posted:

Easy forgetable album, already forgotten by the world and most of the fans (in too short time period)...sory folks (specialy Neil and Liam), but thats how it is...

I don’t agree with this. It is a unique album that has been released with virtually no promotion or tour, just as all focus is turning to Neil in Fleetwood Mac. That doesn’t make it forgettable. The timing for it is just very unfortunate. 

I personally think it is one of Neil’s more memorable albums because it is different (like The Finn album was when that came out). But like a lot of Neil’s recent work, I completely get that it just won’t resonate with all fans and could even alienate some. I can respect that, but think it is a stretch to say it has been forgotten by most of the fans. 

Great to see that there are few fans who actualy like Lightsleeper, but it says nothing about its value... album didnt get almost any attention outside fan base, with this album wont be any new fans (not only for non promotion reasons), there are almost no critic praises above average, and finaly, there is no actual attention here...if you compare it to released CH discs few years ago, or Intriguer, it is just drop in water.., and last but not least, and most important to me, there is no single memorable melody on that album, no interesting twists, turns and hooks...boring Neil with songs which in time of CH would be on C side or teared apart by Mitchel Froom (even didnt remember their names so must look for  song titles): Hiding Places, We know what it means, than songs in which artists obviously enjoy much more than audience like Where s my room and Meet me in the air, songs which potential stucked in the lack of inspiration or lousy nailing like Listen and Anger plays a Part... what we have good here is Liam in pretty good shape, but honestly with much less music potential and talent than Neil or worlds A league...sory to them, sory to fans, but thats just how it is...

Sorry, we will have to just agree to disagree. How you feel about an album is how you feel, but it is not "just how it is". It is personal taste and preference. Music will always be very subjective.

I think Light Sleeper has way more interesting twists and turns than Intriguer (my least favourite of all Neil's work), and the hooks and melodies are subtle - which for me makes them more interesting. I think Light Sleeper is completely inspired. On the other hand I found Intriguer to be a mess, like Neil was caught between what he thought Crowded House should sound like, and the actual music he wanted to make himself (that eventually came out in Dizzy Heights). To me, it sounded like it was originally inspired while the Crowdies were on the road (and some of that comes through in the excellent deluxe bonus disc - which I love), but it was overworked, second guessed, and completely lost its way in the studio. I am only mentioning this to show, that you just can't generalise on how people perceive music. I love that some people really like Intriguer. For me it is a mess, for others it is a masterpiece. 

If we are talking critics, it looks like they were divided much like the fan base. Both Q Magazine and Uncut gave Light Sleeper an 80% (which I would rate above average), but the same magazines gave Intriguer 60%. Mojo has the opposite with Intriguer 80% and Light Sleeper 60%.

Pop Matters gave Light Sleeper its worse review 50%, (it gave Intriguer 70%). I can get that - I wouldn't call Light Sleeper a pop album. I think that is the problem - if you are rating it as a pure pop album, you will be disappointed. It is certainly not what I would call pop. And Crowded House could produce incredible pure pop music. If somebody loves Crowded House, and specifically compare Light Sleeper to those expectations, then I can understand they would be disappointed. 

Here is a 5 star review of Light Sleeper that describes it as "a work of genius": https://www.noted.co.nz/cultur...eper-work-of-genius/

If you don't like the type of music that Light Sleeper represents, that is fine. But it doesn't mean it has any less musical value. Lets face it, none of Neil's work has ever really taken the world by storm since Together Alone, but it has evoked strong responses from the fan base (both positive and negative). His musical output is quite eclectic in style. It is quite possible that you may love one and album and hate the next, and the fan next to you thinks the complete opposite. But to say one album has less value than the other because of how you feel about it is wrong. It just has less value to you.

I think the fact that it is a different type of music, it will get attention outside the fan base. I thought it was great how Jaffaman's teenage daughter adores Light Sleeper and is getting the album for friends. Its biggest problem will be promotion now that Neil is caught up in the Fleetwood Mac frenzy

I completely respect that you don't think the album is a good reflection of Neil's talents, but to make blanket statements about its lack of value and inability to win over new fans, does make an assumption that all potential fans view music in exactly the same way as you. 

I have friends who have never liked Neil's work, actively hate Crowded House (too poppy, too twee, too old school), but much to my surprise really like Light Sleeper.

Whysus posted:
Mariola posted:
Whysus posted:
Mariola posted:

Easy forgetable album, already forgotten by the world and most of the fans (in too short time period)...sory folks (specialy Neil and Liam), but thats how it is...

I don’t agree with this. It is a unique album that has been released with virtually no promotion or tour, just as all focus is turning to Neil in Fleetwood Mac. That doesn’t make it forgettable. The timing for it is just very unfortunate. 

I personally think it is one of Neil’s more memorable albums because it is different (like The Finn album was when that came out). But like a lot of Neil’s recent work, I completely get that it just won’t resonate with all fans and could even alienate some. I can respect that, but think it is a stretch to say it has been forgotten by most of the fans. 

Great to see that there are few fans who actualy like Lightsleeper, but it says nothing about its value... album didnt get almost any attention outside fan base, with this album wont be any new fans (not only for non promotion reasons), there are almost no critic praises above average, and finaly, there is no actual attention here...if you compare it to released CH discs few years ago, or Intriguer, it is just drop in water.., and last but not least, and most important to me, there is no single memorable melody on that album, no interesting twists, turns and hooks...boring Neil with songs which in time of CH would be on C side or teared apart by Mitchel Froom (even didnt remember their names so must look for  song titles): Hiding Places, We know what it means, than songs in which artists obviously enjoy much more than audience like Where s my room and Meet me in the air, songs which potential stucked in the lack of inspiration or lousy nailing like Listen and Anger plays a Part... what we have good here is Liam in pretty good shape, but honestly with much less music potential and talent than Neil or worlds A league...sory to them, sory to fans, but thats just how it is...

Sorry, we will have to just agree to disagree. How you feel about an album is how you feel, but it is not "just how it is". It is personal taste and preference. Music will always be very subjective.

 

I wont go any further with quotes, its pointless. It is personal but it also can be objective to some point. I know that there will always be some who will say that One Nil is best album Neil ever did, I respect that and his own taste, but its just not universaly acclaim thing. Same with Lightsleeper.. you can even hate Intriguer, but Intriguer definitely made much more attention not only here, but in world generaly...when you talk about critics, with Lightsleeper you have few more than five reviews from influencive media, on Intriguer were almost three times more..plus five times more from less known media..Lightspleeper didnt spawn any attention not only cause Neil joined Fleetwod Mac, but also album didnt interested anyone except fan base, and within us, there are only few who still talks about it, only two months after relesead.

Also, on five last albums, almost every song had its own thread here months after released- where is that now? You honestly think its only for FM sake, so you have to jump on my every criticising this album??? Actually fans listen it every day, enjoy it, anual lists of best albums of the year just wait to put Lightsleeper on it, there are hundred of thousands views of singles on youtube, and everything support your theory that Lightsleeper is actualy great remarkable album? Yeah, wright...

Music is subjective. I adore the Out of Silence album but many others think it's a one-tone forgettable album.  Likewise, Lightsleeper isn't for everyone.  I think it's a great album that fits nicely in the second tier of Neil albums but I recognize that others may find it too dreamy.

There is a belief among fans that the goals of their favorite artists should align with the fans goals for that audience. When fan goals and artist goals are not in unison, divisions in the fandom appear. 

Sometimes when Neil puts out an album, be it Crowded House, Finn Brothers or solo, it's clear that his goal is to take on the world. Get singles on radio and in TV shows, tour every corner of the globe, and produce pop songs that will achieve that goal. Of course, that's the Neil Finn that brought most of us here.

But at this stage in his career, a different Neil Finn has emerged. A Neil Finn who is releasing music for the sake of exploring his own interests and deepening his relationships with his family and friends. I like it when Neil rolls out the giant promotional machine and pushes pop song production as far as his muse will allow. But to call Lightsleeper a failure is to have different goals for the album than Neil Finn. 

I don't think Neil will look back at Lightsleeper or OoS and think those albums were a mistake because they sold poorly relative to other albums or didn't have songs that got in the charts. When you record and release two experimental albums in two years with limited promotion, you're saying you want to try something new and just get it out into the world. I think they would be a failure if Neil was mounting a world tour around them and no one was showing up to shows, but that clearly isn't what he was looking for. 

As a fan, I'm just thrilled that Neil is being so prolific. Neil is not going to write and record albums forever (see Tim Finn). I'm greedy and want the largest Neil Finn collection I can get. The Everyone Is Here/Time On Earth era was an incredible resurgence. And I think it'll happen again. Like Neil says, CH is up on blocks in the garage. Which I take to mean that his aspirations for writing pop albums and doing massive promotion are also up on the blocks. He'll come back around to it, but he's not in any hurry. 

If self indulgent experimental albums with limited promotion are not your thing, it's not that Neil has done anything wrong. It's just that he has different expectations for his current work than we do. I think these recent albums are artistic triumphs and I think that's what Neil and co. were going for so I'm calling them a success. You may disagree, but to call them a failure because not enough critics are reviewing them or their singles aren't on the radio is, in my personal opinion, judging the music by the wrong metrics.

Paināporo posted:

There is a belief among fans that the goals of their favorite artists should align with the fans goals for that audience. When fan goals and artist goals are not in unison, divisions in the fandom appear. 

Sometimes when Neil puts out an album, be it Crowded House, Finn Brothers or solo, it's clear that his goal is to take on the world. Get singles on radio and in TV shows, tour every corner of the globe, and produce pop songs that will achieve that goal. Of course, that's the Neil Finn that brought most of us here.

But at this stage in his career, a different Neil Finn has emerged. A Neil Finn who is releasing music for the sake of exploring his own interests and deepening his relationships with his family and friends. I like it when Neil rolls out the giant promotional machine and pushes pop song production as far as his muse will allow. But to call Lightsleeper a failure is to have different goals for the album than Neil Finn. 

I don't think Neil will look back at Lightsleeper or OoS and think those albums were a mistake because they sold poorly relative to other albums or didn't have songs that got in the charts. When you record and release two experimental albums in two years with limited promotion, you're saying you want to try something new and just get it out into the world. I think they would be a failure if Neil was mounting a world tour around them and no one was showing up to shows, but that clearly isn't what he was looking for. 

As a fan, I'm just thrilled that Neil is being so prolific. Neil is not going to write and record albums forever (see Tim Finn). I'm greedy and want the largest Neil Finn collection I can get. The Everyone Is Here/Time On Earth era was an incredible resurgence. And I think it'll happen again. Like Neil says, CH is up on blocks in the garage. Which I take to mean that his aspirations for writing pop albums and doing massive promotion are also up on the blocks. He'll come back around to it, but he's not in any hurry. 

If self indulgent experimental albums with limited promotion are not your thing, it's not that Neil has done anything wrong. It's just that he has different expectations for his current work than we do. I think these recent albums are artistic triumphs and I think that's what Neil and co. were going for so I'm calling them a success. You may disagree, but to call them a failure because not enough critics are reviewing them or their singles aren't on the radio is, in my personal opinion, judging the music by the wrong metrics.

Good post. So interesting that our expectations and our favorite musicians' expectations may not always be in line. For example, I'm a huge fan of Colin Hay, another great musician who rose to fame in the 80's. Colin used to write great pop songs in his sleep but now he's mostly focusing on melancholic, slow acoustic songs.  Some fans love the new stuff and some yearn for the Men At Work type songs. I've realized that great artists need to follow their muse irrespective of what the fans want.  Artists who follow the wants of their fans usually lose their creative power and end up recycling old material. 

I'm sure I read somewhere that Neil said ages ago that he's like to remove success (and I'm assuming he meant commercial success) as a motivator or a requirement for what he did. 

 

If you look at everything he's done since 1994, you could reason that everything is a different turn on the previous work. I think there have been some super things. The thing I am least interested in is Intriguer - for me it was probably too pop.  I like that I don't know what he will do next and he keeps us all guessing - what bets for a musical with Tim next? 

If you don't like Light sleeper, I'd say your either not giving it a fair listen or to be harder, you just don't want to. Its one of those records that flows smoothly from start to end - usually the hallmark of a very decent record. 

 

Monsieur Nick posted:

If you don't like Light sleeper, I'd say your either not giving it a fair listen or to be harder, you just don't want to. Its one of those records that flows smoothly from start to end - usually the hallmark of a very decent record. 

 

Or ...

Perhaps it was a million miles away from the type of album you hoped to get from Neil & Liam, so you put it aside for a month, then revisited it a couple of times with a set of headphones and a fresher, more open, frame of mind, and now ... 

Yes, you can admit that the album’s soft ambience is well-crafted, and that there are a few nice snatches of melody here and there, but still ... you find that none of the songs, nor the album’s feel as a whole, really grabs you enough to make you WANT to have another listen.

I suppose that if I liked having dreamy, ambient-heavy, sparse-on-melody music playing in the background while I did other things (or did nothing at all), this album would get more spins, and I might develop a better appreciation for its subtleties.  But, alas, I do not.  It's nothing against Neil & Liam, it's just not how I relate to music, theirs or anyone else's.

Hey, I don’t knock or question anyone for liking “Lightsleeper” — art is subjective, after all — but nor do I want be labeled as unfair or stubborn for NOT liking it.  ;-)

Or, 

Its just among worse albums Neil ever did

I listened it quite enough times, thank you, still listening, but its just an album almost without spark, twist and turns, with few self important songs (like Wheres my room), unfinished or badly nailed songs like Anger plays a part and Listen, or just boring going nowhere songs like Hiding places and We know what it means...album on which our favorit musician (Neil) is pretty unfit while his son Liam is excellent, but not capable to reach those heights we were used from Neil. So, results are pretty mixed, obviously.

If someone think I have issues with its slow tempo and dreaminess, I ll say that Out of Silence album is among best things Neil have ever done. Nothing here on Lightsleeper comes close to Love is Emotional, Chameleon Days, Widows Peak, Terorrise Me, and I know different. Like many critics noticed (not just one, from NZ probably, in case of Lightsleeper) OOS is work of genious - excellent songwriting, fraich approach, best Neils singing maybe ever, fantastic use of choir as additional instrument in most of the songs. Almost nothing of that spark appeared on Lightsleeper, just an album which was destined to be produced one day, but without real cohesivenes beetwen musicians or well known lucidness from Neil.

You dont believe me, and still think its just matter of that I listened Lightsleeper "only" 10 times? Fair enough, just google Out of Silence reviews and Lightsleeper reviews, youll see that first two pages of OOS reviews are almost all between 4 and 5 stars, while Lightleeper are most 3 stars, or few 4 and 2 stars reviews. Difference is obvious, and well noticed even on 5 listenings.

But, since loud minority is again in force here about this question, I probably wont wright anyhing more about it. Enjoy in Lightsleeper, I also enjoy in some parts of it, but it doesnt mean that Lightsleeper is not among lowest points in Neils carreer. Thanks for reading.

Mariola posted:

Or, 

Its just among worse albums Neil ever did

I listened it quite enough times, thank you, still listening, but its just an album almost without spark, twist and turns, with few self important songs (like Wheres my room), unfinished or badly nailed songs like Anger plays a part and Listen, or just boring going nowhere songs like Hiding places and We know what it means...album on which our favorit musician (Neil) is pretty unfit while his son Liam is excellent, but not capable to reach those heights we were used from Neil. So, results are pretty mixed, obviously.

If someone think I have issues with its slow tempo and dreaminess, I ll say that Out of Silence album is among best things Neil have ever done. Nothing here on Lightsleeper comes close to Love is Emotional, Chameleon Days, Widows Peak, Terorrise Me, and I know different. Like many critics noticed (not just one, from NZ probably, in case of Lightsleeper) OOS is work of genious - excellent songwriting, fraich approach, best Neils singing maybe ever, fantastic use of choir as additional instrument in most of the songs. Almost nothing of that spark appeared on Lightsleeper, just an album which was destined to be produced one day, but without real cohesivenes beetwen musicians or well known lucidness from Neil.

You dont believe me, and still think its just matter of that I listened Lightsleeper "only" 10 times? Fair enough, just google Out of Silence reviews and Lightsleeper reviews, youll see that first two pages of OOS reviews are almost all between 4 and 5 stars, while Lightleeper are most 3 stars, or few 4 and 2 stars reviews. Difference is obvious, and well noticed even on 5 listenings.

But, since loud minority is again in force here about this question, I probably wont wright anyhing more about it. Enjoy in Lightsleeper, I also enjoy in some parts of it, but it doesnt mean that Lightsleeper is not among lowest points in Neils carreer. Thanks for reading.

I don't disagree much. For me, Silence is in the top tier of anything Neil has ever done. Right there with Together Alone and Woodface. A masterpiece. Lightsleeper is good and I enjoy it and it would be a great album for most musicians. For Neil, it's just a solid mid- level album. Good but not great. I suspect the album would be a lot better and more emotional if it has been produced in a live studio like Silence was. 

Sugar Mouse posted:

I don't disagree much. For me, Silence is in the top tier of anything Neil has ever done. Right there with Together Alone and Woodface. A masterpiece. Lightsleeper is good and I enjoy it and it would be a great album for most musicians. For Neil, it's just a solid mid- level album. Good but not great. I suspect the album would be a lot better and more emotional if it has been produced in a live studio like Silence was. 

Yes, I know you and me was and still are maybe bigest fans of OOS ever! I enjoy sharing that feelings with you. I can go with describing Lightsleeper as "good" album, but in Neils case is "only good", in a way One Nil or Pajama Club was good, but for me, far from his best, or what hes capable of. I dont know Liams opus that much, but from this point I think he s reach his top with Lightsleeper, and I am glad for tham, speccialy for Liam that they shared album together. But, I wish Neil was more fit, more lucid, more sparkled than he was on that album.

Thats the thing, I think Lightsleeper is about what I would have expected from Neil or Liam. If you look at Pajama club, Dizzy heights and to some extent out of silence, it sits neatly within those records. This is something that they have worked on over a period of about 3 years and has been nurtured carefully. 

 

I genuinely amazed that anyone could think this is the worst thing he's ever done - thats quite a strong comment, don't you think? I mean no spark, songs that go nowhere.... maybe you need to turn the volume up a bit :-)

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