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quote:Originally posted by KEROUAC:
That's interesting quadcaster as I really liked Peter's drumming. He was more of a rock oriented drummer than Matt which I think would have lent something else to the newer albums.
quote:Originally posted by adidasman:
Sorry. Peter Jones was a boring, unimaginative drummer. And he didn't have much personality, at least not that you could discern from the audience. Nick obviously has a great deal of fondness for him for some reason - perhaps just because he was dependable and solid as a player and I'm sure he's a nice bloke - but he just seemed out of his element in CH. He was an adequate interim solution, but nothing more.
Being quiet and lacking personality are far from being the same thing. And, as a musician, I found nothing compelling about his playing. (That doesn't make me right; it's just my opinion.) I will, however, stand by my original statement. I've nothing against Peter Jones, but he was, as far as I'm aware, never a member of CH - any more than Mark Hart was before TA. He was a sideman, a hired gun. Matt Sherrod is a member of the band, hence him rightly being described as Paul Hester's replacement.quote:Originally posted by Jeremy Loder:quote:Originally posted by adidasman:
Sorry. Peter Jones was a boring, unimaginative drummer. And he didn't have much personality, at least not that you could discern from the audience. Nick obviously has a great deal of fondness for him for some reason - perhaps just because he was dependable and solid as a player and I'm sure he's a nice bloke - but he just seemed out of his element in CH. He was an adequate interim solution, but nothing more.
Well I've seen the crowdies live three times thru the years. With Paul drumming at a free concert in Manakau Square Auckland in 94, with Peter at the REM/CH/Grant lee Buffalo triple bill at Western Springs Auckland in 95 and with Matt in Christchurch on the Time On Earth tour.
And ok I'll grant you that at the 95 gig it was Nick and Neil doing all the banter and jokes. But I was blown away by Peter Jones drumming. He's to my ears an exceptional rock drummer and I think it sucks how Matt always gets called Paul's replacement and generally people forget Peter.
Hey Mark Hart's a quiet guy on stage. Does that make him any less of an awesome talent? Course not. Same with Peter.
quote:Wayne Duncan who played with Daddy Cool is on Bass
quote:Originally posted by Kittybear:
and yet Jeremy, Peter gets no acknowledgment on RD as being part of the band, the liner notes only state that CH are Neil Finn, Mark Hart and Nick Seymour.
Peter's contribution is only acknowledged along with Tim, Eddie Rayner and Wally Ingram on the Live cd.
Gryphon says otherwise regarding Peter Jones being considered when they reformed, just a post or two above. If you can show me one single official picture of the band with Peter Jones in it, or one credit on a record or press release that mentions him AS A MEMBER OF THE BAND - not just as having played on a track - I'll apologize and revise my opinion of Peter Jones. His having played on the sessions they did in '95 doesn't mean anything; was Mitchell Froom ever considered a memeber of CH? No, and he played on tons of CH tracks. I don't mean to drag the guy down or anything, but he was just a fill-in. Nothing wrong with that. Anybody who got to play for a while with Crowded House has to be a good musician and a good guy, so my hat's off to him. (And I'm sorry I made you mad - I didn't mean to. I just think we need to keep Peter Jones' contribution to CH in perspective.)quote:Originally posted by Jeremy Loder:
Adidasman, you are wrong. Paul left in 94, Peter Jones did officially replace him and drummed with them until their break up in 96.
Peter Jones was not a hired hand. He was a band member. He participated in the aborted 95 CH recording sessions. From which the song Help Is Coming comes from, which Jones also co wrote.
Paul only returned to play drums on the three new songs on Recurring Dream as it was the hits album was meant to mark the end of that era. Peer drummed at all overseas gigs to promote the best of, even when the break up announcement had been made. Paul only did the final aussie dates and the Farewell gig because the band was breaking up.
And my understanding from several sources is that when Neil and Nick got the band back together, Peter Jones was again offered the gig. As being a teacher is now apparently his main gig he turned it down.
Sorry but what you said really pissed me off. Not because it's a opinion thats different to mine. Hey I love and respect intelligent debate over good music, with like minded passionate people. But seriously dude, Peter Jones deserves more respect.
That credit, I always felt, referred to the members of CH at the time of the release of RD - not to anyone who had been a member previously (Paul, Tim). That's not the result of some hasty packaging of the album; that's very specific and intentional. That says, "Regardless of who's been in the band before - and that includes Paul Hester, who plays on the new songs - Crowded House are Neil Finn, Nick Seymour, and Mark Hart. Period." And, at the time of RD's release, CH were still an active band. That, along with the fact that Paul played on the new tracks, would lead one to assume that they considered CH a three-piece group at that time - meaning Peter Jones wasn't ever an official member of the band.quote:Originally posted by Kittybear:
and yet Jeremy, Peter gets no acknowledgment on RD as being part of the band, the liner notes only state that CH are Neil Finn, Mark Hart and Nick Seymour.
Peter's contribution is only acknowledged along with Tim, Eddie Rayner and Wally Ingram on the Live cd.
quote:The gig is at the Yarra Glen Grand Hotel
It implies a subservient role, I think. A secondary role.quote:Originally posted by Crisp:
"He served us well" is what Neil said of Peter Jones--the words "serve" and "us" have always
stuck with me, and the phrase taken as a whole implies what?
quote:Originally posted by adidasman:It implies a subservient role, I think. A secondary role.quote:Originally posted by Crisp:
"He served us well" is what Neil said of Peter Jones--the words "serve" and "us" have always
stuck with me, and the phrase taken as a whole implies what?
quote:Originally posted by Jeremy Loder:quote:Originally posted by adidasman:It implies a subservient role, I think. A secondary role.quote:Originally posted by Crisp:
"He served us well" is what Neil said of Peter Jones--the words "serve" and "us" have always
stuck with me, and the phrase taken as a whole implies what?
This is getting ridiculous. We put the question to Mr Peter "Gryphon" Green. A man who has worked with Split Enz/CH/everything........ for some 30 years. Gryphon has stated Peter Jones was a band member. And I'd say that Gryphon would be closer to the band and know better than us. But rather than backing down graciously your trying to put your own slant onsomething Neil said. Could it be that your just taking Neil's words a bit to literally.
And like Gryphon said, just like with Tim at the farewell show CH had Peter get up on stage. So clearly Nick, Mark, Neil and even Paul wanted Peter to be part of what was at the time the final chapter of their career.
quote:Originally posted by stuartjb:
For anyone who STILL doubts this (even though Gryph has made it crystal clear for crying out loud!) please refer to page 131 of the most recent edition of the book "Private Universe" by Kerry Doole and Chris Twomey.Here you will see a clearly "posed" publicity photo with Mark,Nick,Peter and Neil.
I'll just settle on saying that Peter Jones was a pretty good professional drummer who ably filled in for the band in a time of need. For that, we thank him and wish him well, and I see no reason to go further than that.Am I risking reopening this particular can o' worms if I give the majority of your comments a ringing endorsement? Probably.quote:Originally posted by slowpogo:
adidasman..I tend to agree with you, and I think sometimes people here have the best of intentions, but tend to overstate things out of a desire to support the band.
Peter Jones is a perfectly competent professional drummer, and he certainly didn't *not* fit in well. But he mostly just served his purpose for little while, and then things changed. I have nothing against him but he was a fill-in drummer for the band, and thus, that's probably how he should be remembered.
To elevate him much beyond that seems a bit silly - he's a "good drummer" in the same way that any professional touring drummer at that level is a "good drummer," but there's nothing terribly special about him IMO. There are many hundreds of drummers (if not more) who, while perhaps not as good a match for the band per se in terms of chemistry and style, are at least as skilled on a drum set as Peter Jones.
There's a certain x-factor that's hard to verbalize which really special musicians have. I think Paul Hester definitely had it on the drums. Matt S. is certainly at a higher level than Peter Jones, IMO, but I'm not sure he has that special quality. My comments are less a reflection of a negative opinion of Peter Jones, than an acknowledgment that superlatives get thrown about too easily in general these days, this board and elsewhere, and far fewer people actually deserve them than it would seem. The word "genius" is a good example. Isaac Newton was a genius, Tchaikovsky and Shakespeare were geniuses. Are even 0.1% of the people that are called geniuses in today's world, even remotely close to being at the level of those people? No. Even Neil Finn is, I'm sorry, not a "genius," not if we're also applying that word to Beethoven. He's certainly a wildly talented songwriter/musician, but that's not the same thing at all.
OK, I'm ranting now.
(I think more highly of Matt than you do - he's not Paul, but he's very good and a lot of fun to watch. I wish his playing came across as strongly on Intriguer as it does live, but I blame the producer for that. One thing for sure, though; Matt is not nearly as idiosyncratic as Paul was, and that hurts him when compared to the late Mr. Hester. Paul was the closest thing to Ringo I've seen - a true original.)
